Building a Business on Kindness: Beekman 1802’s Secret to Success

*This transcript was auto-generated*

Josh Kilmer-Purcell:

Just because, you know, there's all these, like you say, MBAs, CEOs, all these letters and numbers out there, doesn't mean that they know anything more than your grandmother did.

Kim Gravel:

We take our gifts, we take our talents, we take the things that seemingly come easy to us for granted. But it's hard to see that for ourselves.

Josh Kilmer-Purcell:

We want to encourage people who have nothing, who feel like they've got nothing, that you can still succeed. In fact, you can succeed better than people who have everything.

Dr. Brent Ridge:

The first thing you need to do if you're starting a business is.

Kim Gravel:

Hey, y'. All. Welcome to the Kim Gravel Show. I'm Kim Gravel, and I'm here with my fantastic, cute, smart producer, Zac. Hey, Zac.

Zac Miller:

Hey, Kim.

Kim Gravel:

That was a lot. I love that you got a lot. I'm in a good mood today, so enjoy. I want to get right to my guest, because today they are two of my QVC brothers from another mother. They are the incredible founders of Beekman 1802. And they turned their small upstate New York goat farm. Yeah, I've got the goat guys here. Into a huge skincare brand that they built on the principle of kindness.

Kim Gravel:

And I want to say this because they live what they built this business on. I'm going to tell you all the stories, so I'm going to spill all the tea on these kind guys in a second. They also won a million dollars on the Amazing Race, so I don't know, maybe that was seed money for the business. We'll find out. And they start in two seasons of their own reality show and their new book, y'. All, I've read it. I'm halfway through. It is called Goat Wisdom how to Build a Truly Great business.

Kim Gravel:

Please welcome Dr. Brent Bridge and Josh Kilmer-Purcell.

Josh Kilmer-Purcell:

I did not know you had a choir.

Kim Gravel:

Look, we have no expense for you guys.

Dr. Brent Ridge:

I'm gonna need that audio.

Kim Gravel:

So, look, this is so weird because normally we see each other and we're passing and we're looking like, oh, God, when are you on? When are you on? When's your next TSV? I mean, we're always, like, two ships passing in the night. We actually. I'm telling you, Zac, we actually had a dressing room next to each other, I think, for the very first time. I can't say a couple of weeks ago. Y' all are busier than me.

Josh Kilmer-Purcell:

No, I do not think so.

Dr. Brent Ridge:

No one's busier than You, Kim, you win.

Josh Kilmer-Purcell:

No, you are non stop. But do you know we see you everywhere. Every time I open social media, you're on there. I see clips of you here and there.

Kim Gravel:

I'm so over myself. So over myself.

Dr. Brent Ridge:

But we don't say, Dr. Brent, you were one. You are amazing. And we have done so many podcasts around the release of this book, but the one that we have been waiting and waiting and waiting on is the Kim Gravel Show. Because this book is all about greatest of all time wisdom. And we say it's like your grandma mba and you are always dropping, dropping, dropping, dropping wisdom. Always. I'm like, I wish I could be as clever as Kim.

Kim Gravel:

But Dr. Brent, is it really clever or is it just you don't know no better? You know what I mean? I don't really know any better.

Dr. Brent Ridge:

No, it's wisdom. It's hard earned wisdom. And I think it came to you from your upbringing, it came to you from your entrepreneurial experience. But you have got it. You have got the wisdom.

Kim Gravel:

Well, and this book has it too. I'm telling you, I'm halfway through and I'm like, dang, this book is good because you talk about business from a different perspective. That's what I love about it. You have built this business. And I will tell y', all, when I tell you that these guys are kind, I don't mean that in a cheesy way. Cause y' all know I'm a straight shooter, right? I just shoot it right down the barrel. And look, and I love everybody, but I don't like everybody. But I love everybody.

Kim Gravel:

But when I say these gentlemen are, I mean, I just remember, remember when y' all first came to the Q and we were talking about something in business, I think it was some of your collabs that you were doing with some of the real prominent other brands in the building and outside of the building. But you were like giving me advice and tell me you truly are for everyone to rise and be loving and kind. It's not an act, is what I'm trying to say.

Dr. Brent Ridge:

No, we want. We truly believe and want everybody to be successful. And that's like you and I had this conversation, I think the last time that we were at qvc. At the same time, we want everybody on that channel to be so successful. Because if we're all producing great content and great product, that just brings more people in and then that lifts everybody up and we make so many people happy. And who doesn't want that?

Kim Gravel:

But let me ask you something. My grandmother used to always say, honey, success is like an all you can eat buffet. It never runs out. But we always think there's so many limited seats at the table. Right. That we're. There's only a handful of seats and everybody's scrapping. But that's not really my motto.

Kim Gravel:

I know it's not your motto. It's really. And it's not really what fosters success.

Josh Kilmer-Purcell:

Yeah, no, there really are two different kinds of people in the world. You know, people who love the win, win and the people who only feel like they've won if somebody else is lost. Like, I mean, and there are people. No, there are people, and we all know them who truly feel only good when someone else is wrong or has lost. And we just don't want to be around those people. We've learned that in business. Like, you just, you don't win. Nobody wins.

Josh Kilmer-Purcell:

It's all about everybody winning at the same time.

Kim Gravel:

Well, and there's a chapter in here I've got. I marked it. I just, I want to go into it because I want you all to tell me what you. How you define your success. Because when you say when the well is dry, because a lot of people, their wells are dry right now, not only like physically, mentally, emotionally, and spiritually, but business wise, we're in a tough time when it comes to entrepreneurship and business. Not that it's ever easy. I'm not trying to say there's ever a point that it's easy, but some of our wells are dry. And how, how do you, how have you weathered the storms?

Dr. Brent Ridge:

Well, one of the reasons that we wrote this book now is, you know, we're 16 years into the business. Yep. And this company started when there was a recession. There was geopolitical turmoil, and there was a big kind of shift in terms of technology. So at that point, it was. Social media was just starting to take off. At this point. Now it's AI getting, you know, taking off.

Dr. Brent Ridge:

And so we said, oh, all of these things that was the birth of Beekman 1802 are happening again. And, you know, I think what we learned from looking at how we started our company and the success that we've been blessed to have is that you can be you, you can have a dry well, but that is understand the worth of water. And that's right. And, you know, that's what we did. We just dug in deep and we just put it in drop by drop by drop until we filled the well up again.

Josh Kilmer-Purcell:

And I know you know this, Kim, because You started out the same way we did, you know, started out small, you know, scrappy. And there was a time, yeah, over the last decade where if you wanted to start a business, you just went around and collected money from other people to, to have investors and start business. We started with nothing. We had nothing. And because of that, every step of the way, every time we had a success, we truly valued that and grew. It grew from that. But when your well is dry, you know the worth of water. That is so true, especially in business.

Josh Kilmer-Purcell:

Because if everything's coming easy to you, like it has for a lot of people over the last few years, you don't really even know what you're doing. You're just reaping stuff you haven't sowed. So we really do believe that. We want to encourage people who have nothing, who feel like they've got nothing, that you can still succeed. In fact, you can succeed better than people who have everything.

Kim Gravel:

I agree with you. I'm telling you, you're speaking truth. Because it's all a mindset too. And you had some reality TV experience like myself. You had been out in the world in a very public and, you know, meaningful way. But what, what made you want to start this brand? Because it's such an amazing story. And I know people, a lot of people have heard it, but a lot of people don't know the goat wisdom. They don't know the goat magic that you guys bumped into.

Kim Gravel:

Was it on purpose? Did it just happen? Was it a God thing? Was it just something, something that you were passionate about? How did it happen?

Josh Kilmer-Purcell:

Well, yeah, I mean, we were two guys in New York City. Brent was a physician. I was a writer. We were two Manhattan career professionals. We had our careers planned out. We were both doing really well. Brent worked for Martha Stewart. He started her health and wellness division.

Josh Kilmer-Purcell:

And so everything was going great. In fact, it was so good that we bought a farm in upstate New York that we stumbled across one weekend when we were going on an apple picking trip. And it was just going to be a weekend place. We're just, you know, like we were those city guys with a weekend place. And then 2008 hit and we both lost our jobs within 30 days of each other. You know, Brent got his pink slip from Martha. It was like perfect penmanship. You know, we're going to have to, have to let you go.

Josh Kilmer-Purcell:

Very polite.

Kim Gravel:

Oh, my God. I love Martha. I love Martha.

Josh Kilmer-Purcell:

No, but so we had this farm. We had no money, we had no income. All we had was a letter in Our mailbox from a neighbor. His name was Farmer John. He was losing his farm. He had 80 goats. He had nowhere to bring them. He said, you have an empty barn.

Josh Kilmer-Purcell:

Can I come on your farm? And that was the first act of kindness, we say, that started our business. We said, yes, John, come. We had no plans of starting a business. We were just trying to help out a neighbor. And that decision helped us immeasurably because when we lost our jobs, we googled what can we make with goat milk? And the first thing that came up was goat milk soap. And so if we hadn't taken in. John, if we hadn't, you know, when we lost our jobs in that recession, we hadn't lost our jobs.

Kim Gravel:

Yeah, yeah.

Josh Kilmer-Purcell:

If we hadn't lost our jobs. And everyone said to us, like, remember there was the mortgage crisis, and they're like, oh, just walk away from your house. It's underwater. Just walk away. And Brent and I were. We were raised. We were like, we owe money. We're not walking away.

Josh Kilmer-Purcell:

We signed a paper saying we owe people money. I don't care if it's a bank, we owe that money. So we said, we're doubling down. We're starting this business, and we're going to make it work. And truly, we made it work one bar of soap at a time.

Dr. Brent Ridge:

And I remember, Kim, Martha was the first person who ever tried the bar soap. And she said, you could start a business with this. And I said, now just think about this. Think about how difficult this was. Martha personally didn't lay me off. It was just the company was going through. And so, thinking I had been laid off, I then had to go to Martha and say, martha, I really need your help. After she had said she liked the soap, I said, could we come on your show and talk about the soap? Like, I had to go back with my hat, my hat in my hand and say, please, I.

Dr. Brent Ridge:

You know, can you throw me a bong here? And, of course, Martha, she loves entrepreneurs. Anyway, she said, absolutely, you can. And so we came on the Martha show. We have, like, the baby goats with us. We had a pot on a Bunsen burner showing how we make those original bars of soap. And that's kind of how we started our company is, you know, teaching people about why the soap and why it was doing and what it was doing for the skin. And, you know, you just do what you have to do in the moment.

Kim Gravel:

How did kindness become your mantra, your motto for business? Because you don't think of those two things as simpatico or together business and kindness. Because, I mean, even Martha extending you that kindness. Do you know what I mean?

Dr. Brent Ridge:

Yeah. Because at the moment when she did that, we weren't thinking, oh, that was a kind thing to do, you know, or even Farmer Tom wrote that original letter. We were like, oh, kindness. It was about, I would say, eight years into the company. And we, even before this, we had always talked about the power of neighbors. We called all of our customers neighbors. We were growing neighbor by neighbor, and we were getting ready to go to launch into Ulta Beauty, and. Which is a big deal because you have to outlay so much capital, so much cash for your inventory, for your end cap displays, for your field team, like, super big expense.

Dr. Brent Ridge:

And we said, okay, we want to make sure that we have dotted all of our I's, crossover T's. We want to be ready for this. And so we had hired this outside branding agency to come in to just look at us and say, okay, help us crystallize what it is that is so special about Beekman. Because when we're on TV talking about the story, it's very clear what we're about, what is our philosophy, what's our DNA.

Kim Gravel:

Yes.

Dr. Brent Ridge:

But if someone passing through the ultrasour, looking at something on a shelf with like a thousand other products around you, how do you communicate that? And so, you know, this whole team of people, they were based in Seattle, and they were actually the team of people who created Brand Tatcha, the beautiful beauty brand Tatcha. And we said the whole team came out to the farm. They embedded with us for, like, three days. They saw our original off. They saw Farmer John, the goats and everything. And then at the end of the third day, they, the head of the company said, you know what? You're not a brand. That's about skin care. Your brand is about kindness.

Kim Gravel:

That's it.

Dr. Brent Ridge:

And we're like, yes, that is it. And Josh always has this great thing.

Josh Kilmer-Purcell:

That he says, you can't describe the mountain you're standing on. And people always ask us, that's it. Yeah. People always said, like, why did you bring in an outside consultant to, you know, tell you who you are? And we said, you cannot describe the mountain you're standing on. You can't think about it every time you stood on a mountain. You can't say how tall it is, what shape it is, how far away it is. You can't describe the mountain you're standing on. And that was a great lesson for Us, and we tell all entrepreneurs, take outside perspective as often as you can.

Josh Kilmer-Purcell:

Even when you're successful.

Kim Gravel:

You can't see yourself.

Dr. Brent Ridge:

Yep.

Josh Kilmer-Purcell:

You don't know why you're successful. Even if you're successful.

Dr. Brent Ridge:

Who in your life did that for you? Like, in your career, you say, kim, you're special. You're. You're good at this. Who did that?

Kim Gravel:

But you know what, y'? All, I mean, first, I'm gonna get that firm's number when we hang up. But I'm just telling you, I don't think we still have nailed it. Because you're so right, Josh. Because it's a thing that. And this is speaking to somebody listening to this right now. I'm telling you, we take our gifts, we take our talents, we take the things that seemingly come easy to us from. For granted. Or we, like you said, Josh, we can't see them.

Kim Gravel:

And I see this a lot when I'm helping other entrepreneurs. It's so easy for me to say. I'm like, duh. But it's hard to see that for ourselves. See, that's why I think your brand is such a strong. I mean, the yellow, the goats are great and all that, but it does lead with kindness, and that is really who you two are as people.

Josh Kilmer-Purcell:

Yeah. The real power of is that not only is it everybody always thinks it's a marketing word and oh, you're kind and oh, that's nice and all that.

Kim Gravel:

No, no, no. Yeah, I get it.

Josh Kilmer-Purcell:

We mean. And internally, it guides our team. So, I mean, imagine having your whole organization, they're having one word as their true north. Every decision they make. Yeah. When they're negotiating. And you said something earlier, people don't think about business and kindness. Business and kindness should match perfectly.

Josh Kilmer-Purcell:

What people mistake is they think kindness is niceness in business. And niceness match perfectly. In fact, that business and niceness are often a big problem. There's a big difference between kindness and niceness.

Kim Gravel:

That's your second book. That's your second book. That's your next book. There's the difference between kindness and niceness. No, but it's true. It's so true. And that's. I mean, we could get off on that subject for an hour.

Kim Gravel:

But you're so right. But can I just say, you have the same philosophy as me, which we've never talked about this, so we're spilling some tea here. We are in the people business. We're not in the product business. I say this all the time to CEOs, to people that want to do brand deals with me that I'm like, but. But you're in love with your product, but you got to be in love with your people. And that means not just the people that you work with, but your customer, your girl, who you're talking to, who you want to experience your product. It's them that's the most important thing, not the product.

Kim Gravel:

Would y' all agree? I think you're. I'm just assuming that with your business, because I can just tell I'm right.

Dr. Brent Ridge:

But go ahead and just confirm it 100%. And I've always said this, even back when I was a practicing physician at Mount Sinai Hospital and I was teaching the medical students, I would say, I don't care what business you're in. You're a physician, you're secretary, whatever. You are in the hospital. You're in the hospitality business, everybody. And, you know, for us, you know, we. I so agree with you about the product. We say that we are in the business of.

Dr. Brent Ridge:

I don't want to say selling kindness, but providing kindness. And so when we think about going on air or doing a public appearance or anything like that, we could care less. If someone is buying a product in that moment, we want them to leave feeling that some kindness was granted to them. And you know what they do, 99% of the time, at some point in the future, that person will come back and reward us by buying a product, but only because we first gifted them kindness.

Josh Kilmer-Purcell:

And you know as well as we do, Kim, we always say, you can sell everything once. You can sell anything once. You can. You can stand up there on air, you can talk, make something sound like the greatest thing ever and sell it once. If it isn't the greatest thing ever, if there's not a fair transaction, they're not coming back. And to your point about the customer being first, we always remember we are asking people to spend their money. Like, at the end of the day, we're asking people to invest, to give us money and invest in our company every time they do that, you know, you would never walk into somebody's house and see money laying on the table and just take it. You know, like, you actually.

Josh Kilmer-Purcell:

You have to earn that money, and we feel that way every single day.

Kim Gravel:

Well, speaking of kindness, now you two have been together how many years? I'm going there 26 years.

Dr. Brent Ridge:

26.

Kim Gravel:

26 years. Okay, so Travis and I have been together for almost 26 years, too, so.

Josh Kilmer-Purcell:

Okay.

Kim Gravel:

And we work together day in and day out. He doesn't Go on air with me. Okay. Josh is actually inhaling and holding his breath here, so I can't wait to hear how this is. So I, you know, I mean, very similar. You know, my partner Travis and I, we are in business together. And you know, my bff, best friend, we're in business together. We don't live together.

Kim Gravel:

Travis and I do. How does that relate to the kindness? How do y' all do that? How do you live together, work together? Y' all been through so much together. What's the secret to making this family business work? Cause that's what you are. It's a family, the community.

Dr. Brent Ridge:

Communication.

Kim Gravel:

Really? Is that all? Because I need.

Dr. Brent Ridge:

It is. It is. You're a good communicator. But listen, let me tell you something, Kim. For the first. For the first five years of the company, you know, it was really tough going. Like, we.

Kim Gravel:

Sure.

Dr. Brent Ridge:

We're not salary. We were. We. We could only eat because we were growing our own food on the farm.

Kim Gravel:

Sure. And got it.

Dr. Brent Ridge:

The reason. The reason we decided to run the obesity race was because the prize was a million dollars. And we thought if we could win that million dollars, we'll pay off the mortgage on our farm and then we can truly invest in the business. And as we were trying to prepare ourselves mentally for the Amazing Race, we kind of watched all the back episodes and we immediately knew these two middle aged gay guys are not going to be the most athletic ones. Like, we're not going to outrun anybody. But if you watch the Amazing Race, what you learn is that by and large, what makes people, what makes teams get eliminated is when the communication breaks down.

Kim Gravel:

Let's go.

Dr. Brent Ridge:

And so then that taught us in that moment, you know what, let's just work on communication. If this happens, how do you want me to support you? Verbally. Non verbally. However, in that experience of running the Amazing Race and training ourselves to communicate in that way and understand how people needed to hear, how each other needed to hear, that set us for success for the rest of the company. Because we carried that throughout the rest of the company. We really listened to one another. Look for the verbal and nonverbal cues and respond to those appropriately.

Josh Kilmer-Purcell:

Okay, well, I'm going to say something that might be a little controversial here because I think when I roll my eyes with you, Kim, when somebody says the key to a relationship is communication, right.

Kim Gravel:

I'm like, oh, no, I get it. No, I believe it. But it's like, okay. Easier said than done. Yeah, yeah.

Josh Kilmer-Purcell:

With couples. Yeah, with couples. Sometimes it's not communicating. There are times you should not communicate. When you're in relationship, communicate as much as you can. Here's the thing. When you're been together 10, 20, 26 years, you know, you can be really unkind to your partner. You know, you can hurt your partner more than anyone else.

Josh Kilmer-Purcell:

And you have that power, like Brent and I have that power. We can devastate one another. So sometimes you don't communicate. You have to not say things that you know are going to hurt the other person. And I think that's a real power, too. That's being kind sometimes. Just saying, okay, what this person needs.

Kim Gravel:

Say nothing.

Josh Kilmer-Purcell:

Yeah, say nothing. And we'll approach this in a different way later.

Dr. Brent Ridge:

Okay, well, let me just twist that in a different way, because I swear, this is fantastic.

Kim Gravel:

This is freaking fantastic.

Dr. Brent Ridge:

The reason that works is because you have already communicated to me in some nonverbal way, either in the way that you closed off the look you gave me. So the communication was already happening. It may not have been this type of communication, but the communication. But it might be. It's happening. Yeah, happening, right?

Kim Gravel:

I gotta tell y'. All. I gotta tell y', all, if we did this on QVC after dark, we would not only sell a lot of product, but a lot of people would tune in. Now, I'm telling you, the reason I'm saying this and getting tickled about it is because I will tell you, you can feel that on camera, that genuineness. Like, there's some times when you two are on camera, and I'll just watch Josh, or I'll watch you, Dr. Brent, and I can just see you're like, okay, enough, and you'll be going on, you know, And I think it's. That, to me, is absolute entertainment gold. That's why I love watching.

Kim Gravel:

Plus, you never know when the goat is gonna crap on the floor. It's fantastic. So, I mean, it's just all the realness of your shows. And I think that our customer, she knows the authenticity. How important is that in what you're doing with your business? What kind of goat wisdom would you put behind the authenticity and the transparency of it all?

Josh Kilmer-Purcell:

That is a really important point. And I want to first say, you know, Brent and I were the very first true couple, real live couple on a reality television show. Like, you were all the gay people before.

Kim Gravel:

I loved it.

Josh Kilmer-Purcell:

Yeah. We were the first real gay couple. And we are definitely one of the only, if not the only, gay couples in home shopping, in TV retail. And we take that really seriously. Like, we know that, that there's a lot of America that is not urban, that is not coastal, that knows no other gay couples. They only know what their media tells them about gay couple.

Kim Gravel:

Yeah. What they see. Right, right.

Josh Kilmer-Purcell:

And so we very seriously take the fact that we are maybe the only gay couple they know. And so we try really hard not to present ourselves as anything else, but to present ourselves as, look, we're a 26 year old married couple exactly like you. We're not putting on a show, you know, we're not super campy, we're not anything. We're gonna. We argue just like you argue, you know, like. So that's part of the reason that we have to be authentic, because we feel that that's we're actually doing a job.

Kim Gravel:

Yeah, but that's what makes everybody love you guys. Because, you know, every time I get on air and I'm so. I might be a little too authentic at times and too transparent. I mean, just, you know, my, my kid gets off a life360 state on air and I find out he's in Nashville. Didn't tell me, didn't ask me. Skipped all of his classes at his college.

Josh Kilmer-Purcell:

Oh, God.

Kim Gravel:

And I'm finding this out on camera And Amy's going, 911, call me 911. I'm like, I'm on air, okay. I'm trying to sell a pre lit Christmas tree for the love of God. And so I just looked at the audience and I said, y' all gonna have to hold on. My kid is just turned his life 360 on and he's making his way to Nashville, Tennessee for God knows why. I don't know what he's doing. Hold on. It's just like they love that, but they love it.

Kim Gravel:

And y' all do the same thing in your own way, you know what I'm saying? And how, how you do your thing. But the authenticity is, I think the kindness for sure. But you can't be fake kind. You guys bring it in such a real way and in. How important is that to your team in the business you're building? Because I think you can't be one way outside of the office and then another way inside of the office.

Josh Kilmer-Purcell:

No. And so many people are. I mean, you hear that so often.

Kim Gravel:

Yeah.

Josh Kilmer-Purcell:

You know, I think it's because we were so. When we started the company, we had nothing. Like we said, we were so challenged, you know, to make this a success. We were just day to day trying to be who we were and make a buck. And so that's sort of stuck with us. I worked in corporate America for a long time. I know what performative is. I know, like how, you know, taking a management course and learning how to be one way or another way.

Josh Kilmer-Purcell:

But when you're desperate and you're just trying to get by day to day, all you've got is yourself.

Kim Gravel:

So is that why you wrote the book? Were you wanting people to be encouraged, inspired by your story? Tell me, what was the reason for writing the book? Cause y' all should have written this book five, six years ago. In my opinion. It's that good.

Dr. Brent Ridge:

We hadn't collected all the wisdom yet. There were a couple of reasons. One, 16 years into the company, we wanted to collect all the stories in one place. One, because we wanted to create a bible, basically for the company. Here's how it happened. And then, yes, we wanted to inspire people. Because what troubles us, looking at the landscape, the social media landscape I'm talking about now, is that you only see very specific versions of what success looks like. You know, it's a set influencer pretending to fly on a private jet, or it's a billionaire, and they're a billionaire, but they still need to sell you lessons, you know, on how to become a billionaire.

Dr. Brent Ridge:

So we said, and those are fine. You can be successful in those things, but there are many, many other types of success and ways to be successful. And we said, we want to write a book that teaches or helps those people who dream of having a business that they start on their Main Street. They start on their Main street, and their goal is to provide for themselves and their family, give back to their community. And guess what? You can be really successful just by focusing on the Main street and in your community. And so we wanted to write all of the tools down on how to do that. And then we said, okay, what is going to. That could be kind of hokey, right? If you're just like, okay, I'm going to give the tools for small Main street business.

Dr. Brent Ridge:

And so we told our book agent, we don't want to shop this book around. We want one publisher for it. Harvard Business Review. And the reason we wanted Harvard Business Review to publish this book was because we wanted people to understand that Main street businesses are serious businesses, and in fact, they are the backbone of the entire American economy. And we knew that people in the realm said, so Harvard Business says this is the book. Then it gave it a sense of gravitas that we may not have had otherwise.

Kim Gravel:

So you're saying scale is not always the answer because Let me tell you something. People in business, and I can't tell you how many people think, Kim, oh, my God. This happened overnight. Okay? Yeah. No, it didn't. It's taken a long time and like you said, a lot of sacrifice and a lot of actual, like a little bit of psychosis, a little bit of psychoticness of drive you have to have. But scale is not always the answer, is it? You gotta work hard. But everybody is not.

Kim Gravel:

You know, my dad used to always say, everybody can't be Oprah. They's a Jerry Springer. There's a. This person. There's a. You know what I'm saying? Everybody. We always look to the big of it all. But big is relative.

Josh Kilmer-Purcell:

Okay, here's another joshism coming at you. There are two ways to shoot for the moon. You can build a rocket or you can build a ladder. And there are, you know, so many people think the only way to get there is a rocket. You know, invest everything, make big, you know, big risks. Take, you know, bold chances. Most rockets never hit the moon. Most of them never even get off the ground.

Josh Kilmer-Purcell:

Okay, now a ladder. You build a ladder to shoot the moon. You know, you're probably not going to hit the moon either, but at least you're going to be further off the ground than where you started. And that's. That is the kind of entrepreneurs that Brent and I are. We're like, you know, yes, we've been really successful, far more successful than we ever thought we would be. But we did it step by step by step, and we didn't risk everything. We didn't, like, make bold moves or take on millions and trillions of dollars of investment.

Josh Kilmer-Purcell:

We did it the smart way, step by step by step. And we're farther ahead than when we started. And those are the kind of people we try to talk to.

Dr. Brent Ridge:

And I'll say, Kim, because we get asked this kind of question a lot when we're talking about the book and about entrepreneurship. And what I tell everybody is you have to decide for yourself. The first thing you need to do if you're starting a business is define for yourself what success means to you. What does success look like for you? Because at the end of the day, a successful life is a life in which you are content with the life you've led.

Kim Gravel:

And come on now, doctor. Come on, Brent. Come on, Dr. Brent.

Josh Kilmer-Purcell:

It's the truth.

Dr. Brent Ridge:

Is the truth. Because you can look at other people's success and incorporate that and think that that is what is going to make you happy and content. And you could work really hard. You could become a billionaire, or you could become famous, or you could whatever. And you could still not be happy and content because that was not the measure of success. That was the right one for you. So you need everybody before they're starting anything needs to look deep down inside themselves and say, what makes me happy and content? And then everything in your life that you're building should work toward achieving that.

Josh Kilmer-Purcell:

I don't want a private. Yeah, I don't want a private jet. I mean, I can barely keep my car.

Kim Gravel:

You don't want a private jet?

Dr. Brent Ridge:

No.

Kim Gravel:

I don't even want a beach house, because it's something else I got to clean and fool with. And then other people ask me if they could borrow. I mean, that is. The burden of all of that is strong.

Josh Kilmer-Purcell:

I once, you know, Brent and I once sat down and said, if we had everything we ever wanted, what would it be? And I said, my dream would be have a new pair of socks every single day. Like, can you imagine opening up a new pair of socks?

Kim Gravel:

They're so cushy. They're so cushy. Oh, my God. That's your next line on qvc. You have a sock line. I feel it. I'm telling you.

Josh Kilmer-Purcell:

Yeah.

Dr. Brent Ridge:

That's our collaboration. Daily socks.

Kim Gravel:

The sock people. Daily socks.

Josh Kilmer-Purcell:

Daily socks.

Dr. Brent Ridge:

Your daily socks. And they have a little bit of.

Kim Gravel:

A little bit of. And they're disposable. You just chunk them every day. How good would that feel?

Josh Kilmer-Purcell:

It would just feel a new pair of socks. Right?

Kim Gravel:

And then we could. We could launch into bras and all the things that, you know, we could really take it so somewhere we can really. But you know what? We laugh about it, but I love the kiss method, you know, to keep it simple, stupid. And that is truly my only wisdom I have in life. And I tell people all the time, I said this to somebody. We were at this big floop de do, high fluting meeting with all these MBAs, CBA, TBA, whatever, CEOs, and they were asking me, you know, and I said, look, I said, I am the wisest person I know. And they all just looked at me like, gosh, she's so cocky. I said, guys, I don't know nothing.

Kim Gravel:

I am learning as I go. And it's always books like this that point us in the direction of the success. And I know you guys really have that for people. You have a heart to see people rise and be everything they were created to be. I mean, you even talk about purpose in the book, there's a chapter about your purpose. What do you hope when people read this, they'll take away from it? Because, you know, my comprehension is like, I have to highlight and reread to make sure I'm getting the. Do have to do that.

Josh Kilmer-Purcell:

Yeah. I hope it removes some doubt for people because the doubt is what stops people from doing things. And in this day and age, we all think like, oh my God, I don't know about AI, I don't know about roi, I don't know about like digital advertising. I don't know this and that. So I'm never going to do anything because I don't know anything. What we wanted to do with this book was say, look, Here are the 12 proverbs that our grandmothers use, that our mothers use and that we use. And guess what? They work. They work for thousands of years.

Josh Kilmer-Purcell:

If you know these things, then you know enough. And that really is true. Remove that doubt from your mind. Just because you know there's all these, like you say, MBA CEOs, all these letters and numbers out there, doesn't mean that they know anything more than your grandmother did.

Kim Gravel:

Well, and you know what? There are some absolutes. There are some things that are just truth, kindness. We know that kindness is a absolute truth. When you are kind to people, what you put out comes back. Press down, shake it together and run it over. And that's why you guys are so successful and that's why it's grown in a rapid way. I mean, I'm serious, what you guys have accomplished in less than really, it was 10 year mark, wasn't it? Like 10, 12 year mark where it really just said, hello world, I'm here. That's remarkable.

Kim Gravel:

That's remarkable that people know that. They relate the yellow and the goat and the kindness to you guys. What are you looking forward to? What's your next five year plan?

Dr. Brent Ridge:

Do you know?

Kim Gravel:

We know the socks. We know the socks. So.

Dr. Brent Ridge:

They'Re called Kim Beats. Kim and Beat.

Kim Gravel:

Kim Beats. That's it. Kim Beats. Oh my gosh. I'm not kidding. I'm on this. I'm on this, guys.

Dr. Brent Ridge:

You know our goal. You know, we always, from the very first day of Beekman 1802, thought about how we're building this company that would far outlive us, right? So we want to be Grenade Terry, to be this idea, a place, you know, a place full of kindness and beauty and health and consideration that would far outlive the two of us. And so of course we dream about, you know, what will happen to the farm, you know, at some point when we can't take care of it, or, you know, Farmer John decides he doesn't want to take care of goats when he's 90 years old, and we're like, okay, how can the farm property itself be a place where, like, a botanical garden where people can come and just sit and be at peace and feel kindness? And then for us, we want to simplify everything, and we want to be nomadic and just travel around the world and spread kindness. Not by being demon, not by, like, standing on a stage and saying, oh, kindness is this and kindness is that. But in simple gestures, like, how can we go into small towns around the world where no one else goes and just connect with people and be kind and show people. Kindness makes you feel good, and kindness, you know, makes the world a better place.

Kim Gravel:

Well, I have a personal story to tell about the both of you before we go and tell the audience, because I knew at that I'm gonna get emotional because so few people are this, especially in business, are this mindful. I don't know if you'll remember this, Dr. Brent, but you reached out to me, and you were doing a product that had the name Belle in it, B E L L E. And you said, I just. Before we press go on this, I just want to make sure you're okay with that. And I thought to myself, first of all, I don't own the name Belle. But second of all, I thought, wow, they really practice what they preach. We've never sat down and had a meal together.

Kim Gravel:

We have never. We've passed and repassed. But y' all are my people. You're my kind of people. You know what I mean by that?

Dr. Brent Ridge:

It's so true, Kim. And that's why I mentioned I have been waiting to this podcast for so long, because we are so appreciative of everything that you represent and what you do. And I. So I can't believe that you remember that moment, because I do. I do. I'll never forget it, because we were coming out with a fragrance called Silver Belles limited edition, just for the holiday. And. And I said, oh, I don't want.

Dr. Brent Ridge:

Cause we had such admiration for you and your business. And we're like, I don't want Kim to think that we are taking the Bell, you know, idea from her. And so I remember reaching out and.

Kim Gravel:

Asking that, because I never forget that, because it's in times like that, y', all, that you know what people. Who people really are and what people say, and nobody would ever know that story, unless I just told it. You know, you probably didn't even hardly remember it when I started of the story. You might not even. But it's just that I say to people all the time, be the friend. Be. I'm going to quote you the neighbor you want to have. And I truly believe.

Kim Gravel:

Like draws like. And you guys are the real deal. And it's. It is truly kindness in its generosity. And I. I know what y' all give. I hear about it all the time. I know how you try to encourage other business entrepreneurs.

Kim Gravel:

But y', all, these people live what they say. Go get the book. I've read half of it. I'm gonna read the other half on the holiday break, on my Thanksgiving break. Cause I'm off for six whole days and I'm gonna read it. I know. See how they're clapping? Cause they know the grind. They know the grind.

Kim Gravel:

They're all going, woo, woo. But I've got. Before y' all go, I do this with everybody that comes on the show. I ask you ridiculous, insane, bizarro questions, and the first thing that comes up comes out. Meaning the first thing you take. Don't think about it, just shout it out. And Josh, you go first and then you answer second. Dr.

Kim Gravel:

Brown. Okay, here we go. Rapid fire questions. Which one of you is the dreamer and who is the realest?

Dr. Brent Ridge:

Me.

Josh Kilmer-Purcell:

Realist. Brent. Dreamer. He is a magical thinker. He is a magical thinker, and I am his wet blanket every day.

Dr. Brent Ridge:

Anything is possible in my world, Ken. Anything is possible.

Kim Gravel:

So he's the feet on the ground and you are shooting for the stars. That's how it's gonna go. I love it. Okay, who's the better cook?

Dr. Brent Ridge:

Josh.

Kim Gravel:

Wow.

Dr. Brent Ridge:

But I love to clean.

Kim Gravel:

Oh, me too. Oh, me too.

Dr. Brent Ridge:

Okay. Do you. I don't want any help. Like, when the dinner is over, I want everyone out of the kitchen so I can clean by myself, please.

Kim Gravel:

And if you, God forbid, you load the dishwasher in the inappropriate way, that is just a sin.

Dr. Brent Ridge:

I know. I start to cringe.

Dr. Brent Ridge:

No, just let me do it. Let me do it.

Kim Gravel:

Well, you're much nicer than me. I'm like, get out. Now. I will tell you that, like, I am a clean freak, too. Like, I mean, I am, but I live with two boys, so all I smell is butt and bo. So I, you know, I've got no other choice. Who's more organized? Ooh, this is gonna be interesting.

Josh Kilmer-Purcell:

Me.

Kim Gravel:

Yeah, I know.

Dr. Brent Ridge:

Do you think so? Cause I was gonna say me.

Josh Kilmer-Purcell:

Okay. Brant, I will go to the junk drawer right now and pull out one by one everything that you put in there.

Kim Gravel:

Okay, but that's a junk drawer, though, Josh.

Dr. Brent Ridge:

I have one junk drawer, and everything goes in it.

Josh Kilmer-Purcell:

You only have one? Because I only get. When we redid our kitchen at the farm, I specifically made one drawer, and I said, brent, you cannot leave everything.

Kim Gravel:

Off on the counter.

Josh Kilmer-Purcell:

It is going in that drawer. And if you leave it on the counter, I'm just putting it in that drawer. And it was in the drawer.

Dr. Brent Ridge:

Everything stayed in that drawer.

Josh Kilmer-Purcell:

Well. Cause it's full. Like, you can't get anything out now. It's packed.

Kim Gravel:

I love y'. All. I swear, this is a show. Y' all don't even know this. So anyway, Dr. Brent, so are you. Do you function really good in chaos? Like, I. Like, my chaos is organized chaos.

Kim Gravel:

Like, my desk right here in the studio. I know where everything is. Don't touch it.

Dr. Brent Ridge:

Yeah.

Kim Gravel:

Okay.

Dr. Brent Ridge:

Oh. Oh, Kim. No, I. If. If somebody comes into the. Our environment, the house, even on set at qvc, and you. They can move one thing an inch, I can walk out on set. But that's.

Dr. Brent Ridge:

That's wrong. That's not in the right place.

Kim Gravel:

Oh, my God. And I'm like, we are crazy. Yeah. That's a creative brain, though. That's a total, like, creative.

Dr. Brent Ridge:

Well, who's a kid? The reason Martha and I have always been simpatico very beginning is because at her company, at the time when I was at the company, there were, like, 800 people. It's a big company then. And there would be rows of, like, desk and cubicles, you know, like people sitting at them. And at the end of each row was a diagram that showed how your desk could be organized. It was like pencil cup. You can have eight pencils or pens or colors or whatever. Like, it was all very.

Kim Gravel:

Do you have a picture of that diagram? Because, you know, we're building the Bell HQ offices. I'm going to set my whole thing up like that.

Dr. Brent Ridge:

Well, you. You come up with your own diagram and, like, set it. And what it did was it kept everyone's brain organized. And because a lot of people don't think that way. They're chaotic brains or they're creative, and they're like, you know, and having that bit of organization really does help. It really does help accountability.

Kim Gravel:

It does.

Dr. Brent Ridge:

It's a therapist.

Kim Gravel:

Yeah, it helps. Who's the toughest boss?

Josh Kilmer-Purcell:

Josh. Okay. Yeah. Whenever we've had to do terminations, as you always have to do in business, it's always Josh. And you know what? I actually stepped forward and do them because when I worked in corporate America, I saw so many people doing bad terminations that didn't need to hurt as much as they hurt. So whenever we have to do a termination, I always step forward and say, I will do this, because there's a way, a good way to do it and a bad way to do it. So I will do it.

Kim Gravel:

Yeah.

Dr. Brent Ridge:

And also, I'm not. I'm a prior. Like, the moment someone else gets emotional or they s eem disappointed, I mean, the tears just start flowing.

Kim Gravel:

I'd be giving them five years severance and everything. He paying for the kids, college, the whole nine yard. I think. I think that's the niceness, not the kindness. You know what I'm saying?

Josh Kilmer-Purcell:

Exactly.

Kim Gravel:

My husband always says, you're not helping, Kim. You're not helping. Okay. Who takes the longer to get out the door when you get ready to go out? Who takes the longest to get ready?

Dr. Brent Ridge:

We're very quick. I mean, we have. We're so low maintenance. Like, we don't. We don't really.

Kim Gravel:

I love it.

Dr. Brent Ridge:

We don't care what we look like. Our skin looks good because of the good it does.

Josh Kilmer-Purcell:

We just got into work. This is actually funny because we. We hated wearing makeup on, like, when we first started on tv. I'm like, I just do not want to put Spend two hours in makeup before I have to go on. So we're like, how can we not wear makeup? And so we turned it into a thing. We're like, you know, we're skin care experts, so we never wear makeup on air. So you can see what you're getting. It's part of the.

Kim Gravel:

It's part of the cell. Yeah. All right. What's one thing you wish you could change about each other?

Josh Kilmer-Purcell:

I wish Brent were immortal.

Dr. Brent Ridge:

Aw. Wow. That was nice. Now you're in the house.

Kim Gravel:

I wish you would clip his toenails.

Dr. Brent Ridge:

I would say with Josh. Josh, as he's been very vocal with on air, is he suffers from anxiety, and sometimes it can be very debilitating for him. So I would like to release. And he's turned to intro positive. And he really works hard to figure out how can make him successful in life. But I would take that burden away from him.

Kim Gravel:

Oh, y' all are just. Oh, my gosh. I would just say I'd like for Travis to, you know, get his teeth whitened. You know, something? I mean, y' all really went for it. Y' all were so deep. Okay, who is Each of your celebrity crushes.

Dr. Brent Ridge:

You know, I don't have a celebrity crush. I never have, like, celebrity has never been a thing for me. I can have crushes on any person in the moment. Like, if someone says something super kind, or I see them doing something, or sometimes if I see someone crying, it's very vulnerable. I'm like, I love you. Like, I just love.

Kim Gravel:

You're the same person.

Dr. Brent Ridge:

Yeah. Southern. Yeah. Josh knows you.

Josh Kilmer-Purcell:

I just got to Rob Lowe. That was a simple one.

Kim Gravel:

Rob Lowe. Is he not aging? Like, is he using the goat system? I mean, because he is not aging.

Josh Kilmer-Purcell:

I know. I know. He looks fantastic.

Dr. Brent Ridge:

He's eating our ass.

Josh Kilmer-Purcell:

He was like my teenage crush. And, like. And he's just kept it up his whole life. Cause he's. You know, it's so nice that he does that for me, that it keeps himself in shape.

Kim Gravel:

He's so hot, and he loves his family. He's just a win. Win all around. I'm with you on that one. What historical person is the goat for you guys?

Josh Kilmer-Purcell:

Well, I was. I would say, you know, I would say Jesus, because I'm. I'm Christian. So, like, that's. That's a given.

Kim Gravel:

Well, honey, like, that's like, the ultimate.

Josh Kilmer-Purcell:

Yeah, that's too easy. So Jimmy Carter, who I always feel is, like, actually very close to Jesus. I feel like that, like, that was his. You know, he lived.

Kim Gravel:

No, he was a Georgia boy.

Josh Kilmer-Purcell:

He preached.

Kim Gravel:

Yep. He lived right down the road. He was a Georgia boy. What about you, Dr. Brent?

Dr. Brent Ridge:

You know, it's kind of the same way with the crush. Like, I see goatness in so many people. You know, like, there's no one person who is the ultimate, greatest of all time. It's like, oh, wow, Kim, in that moment when you said that, that was your greatness coming out.

Kim Gravel:

I get it.

Dr. Brent Ridge:

I really do, like, see greatness. So many people out, and I'm just. I just walk. I'm like, well, can you believe it?

Kim Gravel:

You know? And the older I get, the more I get that way, too. It's like, I see people in a really. I don't see what they. You know what I mean? I don't. I'm not describing. You just start seeing. Really.

Dr. Brent Ridge:

You do that with your sons, Kim, because.

Kim Gravel:

Actually. Because it's hard.

Dr. Brent Ridge:

No. If you look at young people and you really talk to them and you see how they see the world, and you're like, well, look at that. I can't.

Kim Gravel:

I would have never felt. I know. And I was never that involved at that age. I was just a total idiot. Okay, the most important. Well, you know, I get. I get by. I get by.

Kim Gravel:

All right. This is probably the funnest and the. And the best question of all. I need your favorite junk food, both salty and sweet. Let's just break it down. Don't give me. I'm gonna tell y' all something. Don't give me no trash like kale chips.

Kim Gravel:

I don't want. I want real down and dirty. Just psycho crazy trash food that's sweet and salty.

Dr. Brent Ridge:

Okay, well, I. I don't really eat that many sweets, so I'll let Josh answer that. I'm a salty. I'm a salty person. Kim, if there is a bag of chips of any variety.

Kim Gravel:

Okay, okay. Anywhere near three chips. Top three chips.

Dr. Brent Ridge:

Pringles. Pringles. Oh, do you like Pringles, too, love? Okay.

Kim Gravel:

Have you tried the good. The.

Dr. Brent Ridge:

It's like the good chip company version of Pringles.

Josh Kilmer-Purcell:

Those are good, too.

Dr. Brent Ridge:

I like them better.

Kim Gravel:

They're not.

Dr. Brent Ridge:

They're. They taste a little.

Kim Gravel:

They're not as agree. So just shut it down, Zac. We're not going healthy here. I want trashy. Just great. Just guilty. Just.

Dr. Brent Ridge:

And then, so Pringles. And then there's also Takis. I don't know if you know, tackies. They're like. Be like, burn your mouth. I like those. Burn your tongue off. My great grandmother.

Dr. Brent Ridge:

This. I don't know if this would be classified, but it's like poor people food. My great grandmother, I would go mow her yard every year from the time I was, like, 8 until I was out of college. And I would mow her yard to me about two hours. And then she would always have. When I would come in from on the yard, made a pot of tomato macaroni. And it was the simplest dish. She, like, boiled some macaroni.

Dr. Brent Ridge:

She put a can of diced tomatoes with some fat back or bacon fat in it, and that was the meal. And I still make Josh make it for me. Tomato macaroni, nothing fancy.

Kim Gravel:

Oh, but it's still.

Dr. Brent Ridge:

I mean, a stove top stuffing. Stove top stuffing right from the box.

Kim Gravel:

From the freaking box every year.

Josh Kilmer-Purcell:

You got so mad at me last time.

Kim Gravel:

How to make fancy stuff a few.

Josh Kilmer-Purcell:

Years ago, because I made regular. I made good, like, stuffing, homemade stuffing. And then I had to make a pot of stovetop. And then I put the pot on the. On the dining room table for Thanksgiving. She thought I was, like, just being.

Kim Gravel:

Rude, but it's good. I mean, it's just down and dirty. Okay.

Josh Kilmer-Purcell:

Joshua okay, I'll give you salty and sweet in one thing. Champagne and potato chips. The best combination in the world. I could live the rest of my life on champagne and potato chips.

Kim Gravel:

Well, try these. There are chocolate covered gummies from Trader Joe's. I just got in the mail. It'll light your pants on fire. They are so good.

Josh Kilmer-Purcell:

Okay, is it chocolate? Is it chocolate thick or is it thin or. That's so different. That makes a difference.

Kim Gravel:

Okay, very thin. They're Trader Joe's chocolate covered gummies. I am blown away.

Dr. Brent Ridge:

Okay, let me. We have a gummy aholic in our friend group. Loves everything gummy candy. You have to put them in the freezer and try eating them.

Kim Gravel:

Yes. Yes.

Dr. Brent Ridge:

I bet you hear the chocolate shell crash.

Kim Gravel:

Just crunch. Just like the magic shell on ice cream. Okay, so when are we getting together and breaking bread? We've got to get together. And y', all, you've got to go get the book. You've got to go get the book. Goat. How to Truly Build a Great business. Go ahead, Britt.

Kim Gravel:

What you got to say, honey? Say it.

Dr. Brent Ridge:

I'll tell you. I'll tell you. When you get your studio built that you're building, we're going to come to a show with you.

Kim Gravel:

Oh, y', all, if you. Now, don't say that. If you not believe.

Dr. Brent Ridge:

Okay, do it, honey.

Kim Gravel:

We are here in Winder, Georgia. You want to talk about Main Street USA, and we're.

Dr. Brent Ridge:

At some point we're going to eat some good food there, too.

Kim Gravel:

Oh, honey, just. I'll make that tomato and macaroni, but. And that stovetop stuffing will be waiting. Now, y', all, you can go find Brent and Josh on social media. Beakman 1802. And make sure you go to QVC. They have so many incredible skincare products. Just, I mean, body care.

Kim Gravel:

All kinds of care at qvc. I buy their stuff. I'm on auto delivery. As a matter of fact. I absolutely love them. Thank you for coming, guys. I love you so much. Come back.

Dr. Brent Ridge:

We will, Kim.

Josh Kilmer-Purcell:

We will. Thank you.

Kim Gravel:

Zac Miller is the Executive Producer of the Kim Gravel Show. His production company is Uncommon Audio. Our Producer is Kathleen Grant, the Brunette Exec. Production help from Emily Bredin and Sara Noto. Our cover art is designed by Sanaz Huber at Memarian Creative. Our show is edited by Mike Kligerman. Our guest intros are performed by Roxy Reese. Our guest booking is done by Central Talent Booking. Our ads are furnished by True Native Media. And y'all, I want to give a big huge thank you to the entire team at QVC+ and a special thank you to our audience for making this community so strong. If you are still listening then you must have liked a few episodes along the way. So tell somebody about it. Tell somebody about this show and join our mailing list at kimgravelshow.com. I cannot do this show without you and so I thank you from the bottom of my heart for listening. I hope you gain a little bit of encouragement, light and love love from watching and listening to The Kim Gravel Show. I love you all so much. Till next time. Bye.