Fearless After 50: Heather Dubrow on Reinvention, Authenticity, and Real Housewives

*This transcript was auto-generated*

Heather Dubrow:

Don't let the neighbor. Oh, no, no, no. We don't talk about things. I have diarrhea of the mouth. I'm the exact opposite. I want to talk about all of it. If you really pay attention to those moments, you will keep growing.

Kim Gravel:

Hold on, hold on, hold on. You got to stop there, honey. Don't you think that's probably the biggest hurdle as women we need to get over? Get ready for the Kim Gravel Show. Hey, y'. All. Kim Gravel, here you are. List to the Kim Gravel Show. I'm your host, Kim Gravel, and joined always with me on this podcast, every single time, is my producer, Zac Zac.

Zac Miller:

Hey, Kim.

Kim Gravel:

I'm so excited about today's guest. I will tell you. I'll break it down and tell you why in a minute after I intro her, because you guys are going to know her from one of the stars of the Real Housewives of Orange County. Oh, yeah. And I mean the good one. Just wait till I tell you who it is. She's such a powerhouse. She is a serial entrepreneur, a podcaster, a mother, a wife, a philanthropist.

Kim Gravel:

She's got four kids. Let's welcome Heather Dabrow. Okay, Heather, I need that plaid.

Heather Dubrow:

Every time I walk into a room. I love it and I adore you and I'm so excited to be here.

Kim Gravel:

Okay, so I have to tell you why you are like. This is like an exciting moment for me. One, I feel like we are kind of. I'm like your Southern sister in a little bit. I mean, I think we're kind of like the same person. Just I'm Southside, you know what I'm saying? Like, you are West Coast, I'm east coast, that kind of thing. And then just to let you know, my sister, Allisyn Lambes, I'm giving her a shout out here. Is literally obsessed with you and Terri.

Kim Gravel:

Like, obsessed.

Heather Dubrow:

That's so sweet.

Kim Gravel:

I don't know if you would say that if you met her. I mean, serious stalker break in that type of obsession, so.

Heather Dubrow:

Oh, my God, that's so funny. It's crazy. Kim. Well, you know. Well, first of all, hi to your sister, Alice. Her name's Allisyn.

Kim Gravel:

Please say Allisyn. Look her straight in the eye. And she's. I think you started following her on Instagram and I thought she was gonna go have her Instagram insured.

Heather Dubrow:

Okay, Alison, I just wanna say hi, and I love you and I appreciate you.

Kim Gravel:

Okay.

Heather Dubrow:

You know what's so crazy? And I know you know this because you've done so much reality TV yourself, and because of your insane, incredible Huge following on QVC that people feel like they know you. And it's just very different. You know, I started in scripted TV for many years, and then I had four kids in seven years, and I took a little break. And then I started in this real reality stuff and podcasting. And it's just so different because back in the day, people would say, oh, I love your show, or I like your character. But now they know you, right? And isn't that just so crazy?

Kim Gravel:

Yeah. But can I just say. Cause we've both done reality tv. You've done it a lot longer. I mean, you were the og, literally, but you're an open book. I can't say that about everybody that has been in reality tv, can you? Like, even with some of your cohorts? Because we're not going to spill the tea today. Because literally, I love every Real Housewives of every franchise. I mean, they all add to our beautiful display of reality.

Kim Gravel:

You know, binge watching.

Heather Dubrow:

It's true.

Kim Gravel:

Very. Like, what you see is what you get with you.

Heather Dubrow:

It's true. But I mean, look, I have to be careful, too. I have four kids, okay? And it's important that I don't tell their stories for them and that they tell. I mean, even. I mean, honestly, even with Instagram, like, we were out for my son's 15th birthday the other night, and there was no photo posted. Cause there were no sanctioned photos. So I'm always really careful to walk the line. Cause, you know, that's not fair.

Heather Dubrow:

Just because I've chosen to do it. When they were little, it was fine. They were cute. They'd, like, run in the room and.

Kim Gravel:

Yeah, they didn't know a difference, but that's fine.

Heather Dubrow:

But when they start to really have opinions and friends and high school and all that kind of stuff, you really do have to be more careful. Now, as far as me and Terri. Yeah. What you see is what you get. That doesn't mean we show absolutely.

Kim Gravel:

No, no, no.

Heather Dubrow:

Everything. You have to keep some things private. But I think what you're responding to is that we're authentic.

Kim Gravel:

That was my word. Authentic. Yeah.

Heather Dubrow:

And thank you for saying that. And you have to be. Because the audience has a BS meter. And if you're not authentic, they can smell it so far away. And that's why, you know, it's very hard to cast these shows now, whether it's Housewives or the Bachelor. I mean, like, spoiler alert. The Bachelor contestants are not all looking for love.

Kim Gravel:

No, they're looking for. Yes. That's it. Oh, My gosh. Okay, speaking of, you are everywhere. So we know you as a real housewife. We have to talk about that experience later. But that's like the low hanging fruit.

Kim Gravel:

I want to get to some of the meat. You have started a new podcast with your husband. I got to say, I met Terri for the first time personally, one on one in LA recently at that event at Vanity Fair, the faith in spirituality event. He is. You are, both of y' all are. So I know you're in love. You've been married how many years?

Heather Dubrow:

We've been together 29 years.

Kim Gravel:

29 years. Which is like 5,000 years in Hollywood. So, like, y' all have been. You've been together forever. And so you decided to start this podcast together. And y', all, Terry Dubrow, he is the plastic surgeon that's on Botched. He's also all over TV and has a thriving career in his business. You're a businesswoman.

Kim Gravel:

You have a. A skincare line, a makeup line, a cosmetic line. What is the podcast about? People have got to go tune in, because every episode I've watched is hilarious.

Heather Dubrow:

Thank you. Well, so I started my podcasting journey about 10 years ago, and I didn't even know, by the way. I'm so bad at technology. Like a thumbs up just happened. Don't know where that came from. I don't get my hands. I don't. I don't get it.

Kim Gravel:

I don't know. Who cares?

Heather Dubrow:

It was fabulous.

Kim Gravel:

I don't know.

Heather Dubrow:

Things happen here. It's fine. Anyway, So I started 10 years ago because my agent at the time was like, you need a podcast. And I said, that is a great idea.

Kim Gravel:

You're a good talker. You're a good talker.

Heather Dubrow:

I go, But I go, that's a great idea. What's a podcast? Cause I didn't know it was 10 years ago. It wasn't. Wasn't like it is now.

Kim Gravel:

It wasn't a thing. Right.

Heather Dubrow:

It wasn't a thing. So I thought, you know, coming from tv, okay, I need segments and I have to figure this whole thing out. And then Dr. Drew, Drew pins, who's a friend of mine who had been a podcaster for some time, even at that point was like, no, Heather, people just want to hang out with you for an hour.

Kim Gravel:

Yeah. Just want to talk.

Heather Dubrow:

They. They do. Are you sure? Okay, I could do that. So I started the podcast, and then I'll tell you after almost 10 years of doing it on my own, and I wonder if you have felt this way at times also. It Went through. It went through many different iterations. I had co hosts at some times. I was on my own for many years.

Heather Dubrow:

Sometimes I would interview actors that were, you know, in films. And then I realized, you know, I don't want to talk to those people anymore. Not that I don't love them, but I feel like I want to learn more. So then I just started having people on that, you know, wrote books I found interesting or, you know, just had a fascinating point of view on life or aging or menopause or whatever it is. And I really did love doing it. And I felt like I got a lot of good pearls out of those conversations. And I made a lot of friends, which was great. But then I got to the point where I was ready to do something new.

Heather Dubrow:

And Terri and I started doing, as my kids would say, these very cringy tiktoks. And they are. They were. And they are cringy. But as a businesswoman, I saw they were getting millions of views.

Kim Gravel:

Yeah.

Heather Dubrow:

And I thought, okay, well, that's something we need to explore more. And so we decided to do this podcast together. And I think what's kind of fun about it is, you know, we always have an idea of what we're gonna talk about, and then it tends to go off the rails because we're married forever and we. And we record on Mondays, which is funny, cause it's one of the only days of the week we don't spend a lot of time together. So when we haven't seen each other all day, you know, it's like, well, what you do.

Kim Gravel:

Catch up.

Heather Dubrow:

It's a catch up.

Kim Gravel:

Catch up. Yeah.

Heather Dubrow:

And to Dr. Drew's point, it's just hanging out with us.

Kim Gravel:

You're hanging out. Can I just say this about you, though? You are. You know, you had your podcast for 10 years, and now you're doing this with. With hubby. You are consistently one of the most popular Real Housewives of Orange Cat. Really? Real Housewives, period. But you're a consistent human being. You know what I mean by that? Like, there is.

Kim Gravel:

I mean, there's drama. There's always these fun nuggets. There's always these, like you said, you called them pearls, which I think is great. But you're consistent. But also, you're always evolving. You're always growing. Why? Why is that, Heather? No, you are. You need to hear me.

Kim Gravel:

I'm saying, like, I've watched you over the years be the same person, but continue to level up. How have you done that?

Heather Dubrow:

I mean, look, I think that you know, we either stay still or we move forward. Right, right, right. And look, when I look back, so I started housewives when my youngest child was 9 months old and he just turned 15. So it's been a while. Now when I look back at some of the drama from all those years ago and my reaction to certain things, I mean, it makes me giggle. But I was younger then and you react differently. And I think that, you know, as you age and hopefully grow a little bit wiser and we all have different experiences and hopefully I learn from them how to be a better person, how to show up better as a wife, as a mother, and as a friend and take the experiences, the good and the bad, and try to grow and be less reactive and learn more.

Kim Gravel:

Hold on, hold on, hold on. You got to stop there, honey. What do you mean? I. You are preaching to the choir. You are, you are, you are now pouring into me when you say be less reactive. Don't you think that's probably the biggest hurdle as women we need to get over? And I'm not just saying like emotion, because here I'm talking to a real housewife about being reactive. You know, it's like that's what you get paid to do. But it's like even with our thoughts too, right, Heather? Yes, talk to me about that.

Kim Gravel:

That's such a huge concept I'm trying to learn right now.

Heather Dubrow:

Well, I think when we're especially girls in their 20s, right, we're all very reactive. How dare they? Can you believe. Did you see? How could she wear that? How could she say that? How could he do that? You know, you get so feisty about caught up little things. And then I think as you get older, you start to realize what's important, what's not important. I think unfortunately for many people, it requires like something bad to happen for people to have what many people call like a come to Jesus moment to go. Okay, let me stop worrying so much about this and that. Now I'll tell you, my life isn't perfect. We've had things, but there have been things over the years that have re grounded me in those moments.

Heather Dubrow:

Terry had a mini stroke a few years ago that I was there for and saved his life. I'd like to add. So anyone thinks that I don't like him, could have gone differently.

Kim Gravel:

Just tell me, like you love him. Like, ain't got nothing to do with it. Like that could be day to day, maybe like him, maybe. Don't I get that?

Heather Dubrow:

Yeah, but so, but I mean, I'm joking. But the truth is, that was one of those moments where you. I didn't need a wake up call. But it does make you take a step back and reevaluate things. You know, when my father passed away and dealing with that, and even this year on the show, I, you know, had unresolved issues with him. And I took his ashes with me to Amsterdam, where my parents lived for 15 years, and I put them in the canal and I had. I didn't realize how much it was gonna mean. You know, just all these things and things that have happened with my kids, from happy, wonderful things, getting into college and, you know, finding a person to date or whatever it is, to the, you know, sad things, you know, the fails and all of that.

Heather Dubrow:

Oh, I think all of those things put your life back into a perspective. And I think if you really pay attention to those moments, you will keep growing. And that is not to say that I am always perfect, that I always do it right. Do I still snap? Heck, yes, I do. And Terri and I still get into arguments sometimes, and we get through them and we move on. But Terri and I, I would say, and our kids, beyond anything else, have an overwhelming sense of gratitude for each other, for our health, for the lives we've been given. And I think that's why we all work hard and want to prove ourselves worthy.

Kim Gravel:

Do you mind me asking how old you are?

Heather Dubrow:

I'm 56. I'm going to be 57 in January.

Kim Gravel:

First of all, y' all need to go and check out her beauty line. We'll get to that in a minute. Second of all, at your age, at 56, can you talk to what your 50s is like? Because I grew up with a mother who kept saying, 50s are your best years. 50s are your. I mean, she said that?

Heather Dubrow:

She did.

Kim Gravel:

Oh, gosh. She has been saying 50s are your best years for, like, God, ever since she's been 50 and she's 78.

Heather Dubrow:

Really?

Kim Gravel:

Yeah. So I heard that as a young.

Heather Dubrow:

Woman, I would have said 40s.

Kim Gravel:

Okay. But I'm not kidding. Like, your career, I mean, your career started in. In your 50s, right? Like, took off. No, I mean, talk to me about your 50s.

Heather Dubrow:

I have had. All right, so each decade has been very interesting for me and very different. All right, like in my 20s and early 30s, I was a sitcom actress. I was on lots of TV shows. I was a Hollywood girl, movies and.

Kim Gravel:

All right, you were a hottie. You were a hottie.

Heather Dubrow:

Yeah, I did all of that. And then I had a decade, basically. Little overlap in These decades, but like a decade of being a stay at home mother. I had four kids in seven years.

Kim Gravel:

Girl. That's all you gotta say. That's all you gotta say.

Heather Dubrow:

So even though I did a pilot here and there, I did a little thing here and there, you know, but this was before content creation. This was before streamers. This was like you were out, I was just, I was home. So I did that. And then in the 30s 40s, I had this decade of reality television and, and podcasting and a YouTube channel and content creation and live hosting. I was, you know, on Good Day LA as their fill in all the time. I remember, you know, all these different things that I never thought I would do. Talk shows and whatever.

Heather Dubrow:

And so the reason why I say I to me, I would have said the 40s is because I feel like you still look really great. And it's before the perimenopause is really in that full swing and you know all those things. But I'll tell you, the 50s for me. Interesting. So I'm 56.

Heather Dubrow:

In the last six years.

Kim Gravel:

Okay.

Heather Dubrow:

Yeah. Okay. So here it is. I realize that I have like, this is it, right? What do I have to lose? I will do anything.

Kim Gravel:

That's what I'm saying.

Heather Dubrow:

I will try anything. Yes.

Kim Gravel:

It's like you're fearless. That's what I'm saying. Like when I say 50s, you know, it's when your career took off. Meaning, like you've got your brands. I mean, Heather, can I just tell you, I'm sitting here telling you right now that you are going to build legacy brands because of who you are as a person who, what your personal life represents. I hope that does. I hope I'm not overstepping by saying that to you.

Heather Dubrow:

No, I love that. Please.

Kim Gravel:

I just, I just feel like women are looking for people that they can relate to and aspire to and I truly think that's you. I truly feel like from a person who, who's in the brand business that I think the rest of your 50s is going to be game changing when it comes to business. That's what I meant to say.

Heather Dubrow:

Well, from. From your mouth to God's ears, I love that. And I'm gonna tell you something, Kim, you're so inspiring. Cause that's you. And that is why when I said before that your QVC audience, you know, we used to sell on a shopping channel years ago.

Kim Gravel:

I know, I know.

Heather Dubrow:

And the audiences are so wonderful and they're so engaged and it really is, it is like having a Reality show. Because you have this. You build this community and it's so beautiful and. And, yeah, okay, so. So the 50s, so this menopause sucks. But I love, like, love that people are talking about it now. I think it's the best. I grew up in a family.

Heather Dubrow:

Yeah, I grew up in a family where no one talked about anything, like, I mean, 1950s, sweep it under the rug. No one. Don't let the neighbor. Oh, no, no, no. We don't talk about things. I have diarrhea of the mouth. I'm the exact opposite. I want to talk about all of it, and I do.

Heather Dubrow:

And I love and you're real about it. That the world does.

Kim Gravel:

Yeah, but Heather. But, Heather, what I'm saying is you're so aspirational. I mean, my lord, to be 56. Look, feel, talk, walk, love like you do. We all want that. I mean, I know you've had diet books in the past. I know you've had, you know, different things, but, like, right now, girl, at 56, people in their 20s are dying to look and feel like you do. I'm just saying, like, the moment is we are here, and I don't know.

Kim Gravel:

I don't know what it is. It's like, is it the years are short and the days are long. I don't know. I mean, I'm just saying, like, the 50s, it seems like, like you said, the time is now. What have I got to lose?

Heather Dubrow:

Yeah, it's like this. When you're in your 20s and 30s and even part of your 40s, you're like, you second guess yourself. So you go to send an email and you read it 12 times and then you put it down and then you look at it again. I don't do that at all. Like, I was curious about something the other day and I sent a message off to, like, the head of the network. Without even asking anyone what they thought, I just sent it out and they responded very quickly, and it was a great. It was nothing I didn't think about. Did I put too many emojis? Should I have put an exclamation point at the end? Because, you know, you can make yourself insane.

Heather Dubrow:

But it all comes back to what you said before, which is. Is authenticity, which is why you and I both do well in branding and all these kinds of things. Because, first of all, we represent things we believe in and we love our community. The worst thing for me right now is all of the fraud that's going on, because we'll do, like a TikTok and I don't know if you're experiencing this right now, but we're going to do a TikTok video and they will AI a video of me and Terri and sell some fraudulent product. Yes.

Kim Gravel:

And as quickly I've experienced it. Yeah.

Heather Dubrow:

As quickly as we can get the lawyers to take them down, something new pops up. So what I hate about that, it's not about the loss of money or anything like that. It's about I get these messages from these people who are so upset that they've been swindled and I hate that. So we try to make everyone whole, but it's a problem.

Kim Gravel:

Yeah. But I will tell you. Well, that's a whole nother podcast. We could talk about all that. But do you ever get tired of being a real housewife or was there. Is there. Jim said, I know it's a blessing. Hey, okay.

Heather Dubrow:

Yeah.

Kim Gravel:

I mean, I'm not trying. I'm not poo pooing reality tv because it's wonderful. Yeah. And honestly, you have been like such wonderful entertainment and inspiration for all of us on Real Housewives. But like, at some point, like, do you ever think about that?

Heather Dubrow:

Yes, of course.

Kim Gravel:

Or being defined as a real housewife? Cause there's so much more to you than that show. But it's a great part of you as well.

Heather Dubrow:

Okay. Two different questions. The first thing.

Kim Gravel:

Okay.

Heather Dubrow:

The first thing I would say, do I ever get tired of it? It's not an easy show to do, is it? Not really, no. It's very intense and, you know, you're pressure. There's a lot going on with your friends and it's not easy. It's not an easy show to do. And especially like this past season got dark and I don't like that. I like fighting over silly things. Petty drama is fine with me. But at the end of the reunion, I gave a little bit of a speech about how this show is about conflict and resolution between our group and we need to stop talking to bloggers and all this other stuff that's been going on.

Heather Dubrow:

I think if we could get back to our roots like that, it would make it a lot easier. But. But some. You know, I could compare it to raising children. You know how you just said before, what do you say with kids? You say the day, the days are long, the years are short. Right. Something like that. That's what Housewives is like.

Heather Dubrow:

Exactly. And also, you know, just even thinking about, like, you know, we do our. There's no glam team. I mean, we do hire glam for certain events. And whatnot. But you're doing your own hair and makeup. You're picking out your clothes, you're slipping.

Kim Gravel:

It, you're schlepping it, you're working it.

Heather Dubrow:

Yeah, yeah, you are. And it's kind of exhaust, but at the end of the day, the platform is so good that my gratitude is big.

Kim Gravel:

Are y' all our friends? Are y' all really friends?

Heather Dubrow:

Yes.

Kim Gravel:

Are you frenemies or friends?

Heather Dubrow:

Well, it depends.

Kim Gravel:

Depends on the season.

Heather Dubrow:

It depends on the season, and it depends on the person.

Kim Gravel:

Yeah.

Heather Dubrow:

So there's that. But then you also asked me, does it bother me if it defines me? I'll tell you. When I first joined the show, I was the first actress to be on Real Housewives. Now, Kyle Richards, who's very talented and is an actress, she was a child actress at the time. She has since worked as an adult, but when she joined the show, she had been a child actress, but she wasn't currently working as an adult. Correct. So when I was hired, it was, like a taboo thing. And so people are like, oh, my gosh, you're gonna be on Real Housewives.

Heather Dubrow:

You'll never work as an actress again. And, oh, they made fun of me. The girls on the show, they still do. Anything about my career that ever comes up, I'm lambasted for it. So I am very proud to be a part of this pop culture phenomenon, truly. And what it's done for me and for my family and for Terry, I mean, botched is basically a spinoff and our products and everything. So I'm really proud of all of that. So.

Heather Dubrow:

But would I. But the only thing that bothers me is that because I have other, you know, facets to my career and my personality and whatever, I, I, I like people to know that I do it all. So when someone is being negative about my career, then that upsets me.

Kim Gravel:

What's next for you, Heather? Are you. Is acting in your future? Are you going to go back to that first love?

Heather Dubrow:

I mean, I'd love to it. Listen, Kim, between you, me, and the wall, it's not like I'm turning anything down. But here's the thing. I mean, and I have done, like, over the past few years, like, I'll do a guest spot here and there and whatever, and a pilot. It's great, and I love it. But I have three kids in college now. Two are seniors and one's a freshman.

Kim Gravel:

Yes.

Heather Dubrow:

And my youngest just turned 15. So I'm now in a position where I finally feel like, okay, he's getting his permit in six months. Like, I feel like I can now explore things that I really couldn't before. And I do not. This is no judgment on any mothers. We all, you know, make decisions for what we have to do with them. Wanted to.

Kim Gravel:

It's the toughest job ever. Yeah.

Heather Dubrow:

But for me personally, I really wanted to be as much as I could with the kids while they were young and that I can't be everywhere always. And there's four of them and whatever. But now I'm very excited to do it all. So Richard Marks, the singer, is a friend of mine and he's got this new album out and it's all like standards and swing music. And I used to have a 14 piece big band that I toured with. And so he invited me to sing.

Kim Gravel:

I heard you sang. I know, I heard it, honey.

Heather Dubrow:

Thank you. So he invited me to sing with him at the car. I'm like, say less. So, you know, I got to do that. And I've been taking classes at the Groundlings, and a girlfriend of mine who's an actress just texted me today and she's like, hey, there's this class. Do you want to do it with me? And I said, yes. And then I've been taking meetings with scripted producers and network people. So the answer is, I.

Heather Dubrow:

I sure hope so.

Kim Gravel:

Well, this is what I'm saying, like to every other woman that's in our position in our. I'm 54, in our 50s, where the world tells us, you're through, you're done. And then you have my mother saying, it's the best years of your life. What would you say to her that's listening to you right now?

Heather Dubrow:

I would say, thank you for saying that. And I hope that's something I will now take to my children. And I hope that everyone tells their kids these kinds of great pearls of wisdom and all of that, because we're not done. We're just getting started.

Kim Gravel:

We're start. That's what I'm saying.

Heather Dubrow:

I'll tell you this, when I turned 50, and I think you'll appreciate this, everyone was like, oh, my gosh, 50. So. And I've never been hung up on age, to be honest with you, because I think if you feel like you're in a successful period of time in your life, you are, Then you're okay. Right? But I felt like, okay, 50. Do I really remember the first 20 years that well? Not really. Okay, so now I'm 50. And so this is like our halftime show, right?

Kim Gravel:

Yeah. There you go.

Heather Dubrow:

We're gonna. We're gonna gather the troops and we're gonna go in the locker room and we're gonna go, okay, what did we do well? What did we not do well? And how are we gonna go into our next 50 and really put it out there?

Kim Gravel:

Now?

Heather Dubrow:

I'll tell you. And I think the reason that I wasn't so ra ra when you first asked me this question is because it hasn't been an uphill, even slope. Which. Which. That's life. Okay. That's life. But what I will tell you is I think the trajectory is good.

Heather Dubrow:

And I think if you have the right mindset and you go through it like that and exactly what you and I are talking about, and you start to live fearlessly, and you realize you have nothing to lose, then everything starts to fall into place. Yeah.

Kim Gravel:

It's almost like talking to you is. I'm so inspired and encouraged. And again, I'm telling you, you're aspirational. I don't know if anyone's ever told you that, but you are. But you're right. It's like the best time is the time you're in.

Heather Dubrow:

Yes. It's now. You don't have. You know, my husband is. We call ourselves. We're Jewish. We were born Jewish. And we're not very religious, and we celebrate everything, but we also call ourselves bujus.

Heather Dubrow:

Cause we're like Buddhist Jews. And Terry. It's true. And Terri is also very into stoicism.

Kim Gravel:

Yes. Yeah.

Heather Dubrow:

But, you know, it's like, so all of the teachings and the practices, which are all very practical, you know. And like, in Buddhism, you say, you know, pain is inevitable, suffering is optional. Right. Like, what do you do with that pain?

Kim Gravel:

Choose your hard, honey. Choose your hard. Because you go out.

Heather Dubrow:

Choose your hard. Yeah. And we only have today, right?

Kim Gravel:

We do what we do.

Heather Dubrow:

And not to get dark, Kim. But, you know, in the events that have happened in the last three days, I have cried a lot. And I have. One of my girls is on her way home from college right now, and she's my last chicken. That's, you know, not in the coop right now, which I'm very, you know, nervous about. I just want to get her home. But these last few days, if they've taught us, I mean, they should have taught many people many things. But, you know, to lead with love, for sure.

Heather Dubrow:

But also that we have today. We have right now. And that's it.

Kim Gravel:

We have right now. And it's what you do with it. I guess that's what I'm talking about Heather and you, watching you on Real Housewives, watching you through the years, watching your career develop and go. I mean, it is. I don't know if that's what you intended to be an inspiration or be aspirational to people, but you have been.

Heather Dubrow:

Thank you.

Kim Gravel:

Is there anything you would change or do differently if you could?

Heather Dubrow:

I mean, like, yes and no. Right? Like, you know, I could. I could write down a laundry list of, ugh, why'd I say that? Or oh, I could have handled that better.

Kim Gravel:

Me too.

Heather Dubrow:

You know, oof, that didn't go well. Or, I mean, and some are major life moments. But the truth is, if. Yes, there are definitely things I would have done differently. I would have handled some things differently. I would have handled some people differently. But I will tell you that I am not someone who is malicious. So if I.

Heather Dubrow:

Whatever I've done wrong was never with mal intent, that doesn't mean I haven't hurt people in my life. It just means it wasn't my intention. So would I go back and change those things? Yes. But maybe I wouldn't have learned those lessons if those things hadn't happened.

Kim Gravel:

Yeah. And I, as a mom, I would do things a lot differently in some areas. But at the same time, girl, I mean, you have four beautiful, healthy, vibrant kids. You've been in a 29 year marriage in the hardest town to be married in. That's what they say, at least. And you're thriving. And I think that you are. What you're saying to all women out there, including me and everybody listening, is that it's not over, it's not a halftime of it.

Kim Gravel:

No.

Heather Dubrow:

And also, I'm also a believer in making changes if things aren't working for you.

Kim Gravel:

I love that, truly. And doing it quickly. Right. Don't. I mean, because I do you. I struggle with the indecision. Do I do this? Do I do this? Because my best friend, Amy, I can't wait for you to meet her too. Cause she loves you too.

Kim Gravel:

But she always says. She always says, girl, you got to release to increase, you know, So I love that.

Heather Dubrow:

That's so good.

Kim Gravel:

Change, change and change when it's not working.

Heather Dubrow:

Yeah.

Kim Gravel:

Make a change.

Heather Dubrow:

I mean, it could be little things. Cut your hair, dye your hair, get the piercing, get the tattoo or move or. Or move to New York next year or start singing or take a class or you know what? And I know this is a terrible thing to say, but, you know, get a new partner. Just because you're a certain age doesn't Mean, I have. I know someone who said, at this age, why bother? And I thought, that is the most depressing thing I have ever.

Kim Gravel:

I agree with you.

Heather Dubrow:

I would never. First of all, I wouldn't want my children to see me just be okay and giving up and being like, well, that's what. Here I am. Why leave now? I'm sorry. You know what? Life is too short. You've got to be happy. I'm not saying selfish and put every. You know, don't think about anyone else.

Kim Gravel:

Make a change. Make a change. Whatever that is for you.

Heather Dubrow:

Yes, make a change.

Kim Gravel:

Okay, so the new thing is. Why bother? Bother, bother. Shake it up. Shake it up.

Heather Dubrow:

Yeah. And also. And also in your 50s. Can I say something else? So Terri and I say it. We've written three books together, we've done TV shows together, all the things. We have a new thing coming out called Dr. And Mrs. Guinea Pig, based on one of our books where we try out all these health, wellness and beauty things on ourselves.

Heather Dubrow:

Cause he's crazy. But anyway, what I would say is. And maybe it's easier for me cause I'm married to a doctor, so we talk a lot about medical things. And I will take anything, I mean, seriously. When I started going through perimenopause, I'm like, give it all to me.

Kim Gravel:

Give it to me.

Heather Dubrow:

Anything. I don't care. I wanna try it all. And I don't care if it's sexual things or relationship things, hormonal, anti aging, whatever.

Kim Gravel:

And I.

Heather Dubrow:

And I'm not telling you to be dumb and go get some black market, you know, ocd.

Kim Gravel:

You're married to a doctor. You're married to a doctor. So you've got, you've got to.

Heather Dubrow:

But what I'm saying is advocate for yourself. You don't have to suffer through life.

Kim Gravel:

Come on.

Heather Dubrow:

If you are sweating at night or you're irritable, or you have these symptoms and your doctors tell. Because I'll tell you years ago, because really, perimenopause starts in your 30s. And they don't tell you that, but it does. And you really should get baseline hormonal tests in your 30s. But I remember in my. Maybe early to mid-40s, going to my then gynecologist and saying, oh, this is how I feel and this is what's going on. And she wanted to put me on an antidepressant. And I then talked to a friend of mine who was a functional medicine doctor.

Heather Dubrow:

She said, absolutely not. She's like, you're not depressed. You don't need that. You'll lose your libido, you'll gain weight, you'll this, you'll that. But the obgyns of that time were not taught.

Kim Gravel:

Yes, it's ever changing.

Heather Dubrow:

Yes, it's ever changing. So find the right doctor for you that hears you and listens to you and wants to work with you and get yourself on track.

Kim Gravel:

Well, I'm going to tell you, y' all have got to check out Heather's. I mean, you have a lot of products that really help with the things that you are talking about. We gotta get you on the queue. I think we're talking to Vic about that.

Heather Dubrow:

We're gonna make that happen. I think we're talking. I would love that. And I have some other stuff to talk about with you offline.

Kim Gravel:

We are going to really dive in together, us two 50 year olds living our best life. Okay, so before you go, because I know you're busy. Yes, before you go, we have to do this thing that we do in every episode called the Rapid Fire. So that you're going to kill this. You're going to be the best guest ever doing this. What comes out. Okay, so it doesn't matter. Just what comes up comes out.

Kim Gravel:

Don't think about it.

Heather Dubrow:

Okay, ready? I love it.

Kim Gravel:

Okay, Rapid fire questions. You can invite anyone in the world, dead or alive, to an episode of Real Housewives. Who's on the guest list?

Heather Dubrow:

Oh, how many people do I get?

Kim Gravel:

Three.

Heather Dubrow:

Okay. I'm gonna bring Oprah.

Kim Gravel:

Oh, well. Oh, gosh, that would be legendary.

Heather Dubrow:

Because I think it would be so funny. And I'm gonna bring Joan Rivers.

Kim Gravel:

Oh, is she resting? Don't you love that woman? She was the best.

Heather Dubrow:

You know, one of my great sadnesses is that I never got to meet her. And I'm friends with her daughter. And I just. To me, growing up as a funny Jewish girl, you know, she was like this icon.

Kim Gravel:

She did it right.

Heather Dubrow:

Yeah, she did it right. And she did it first. And it was. I just, you know, just always been obsessed. And then who else would I bring?

Kim Gravel:

You? Okay. Oh, Lord. Honey.

Heather Dubrow:

Oh, I'd love to see that.

Kim Gravel:

Lord have mercy, Lord.

Heather Dubrow:

By the way, I might be able to make that happen. Kim, season 20.

Kim Gravel:

Season 20. We gotta get you going on the queue too. Okay, here we go. Best diet hack. Please give us something good. Cause you look good, girl.

Heather Dubrow:

Oh, well, you know, we wrote a book about this, but I'm an intermittent faster and I'm telling you great things about that. Intermittent fasting is the best thing on the planet. You don't even have to read the book. I'm just gonna tell you. 18 hours is the magic number. And you might think that's insane. You could still do bone broth and stuff like that. You can have, like, under 200 calories.

Heather Dubrow:

But I am telling you that there's a thing called autophagy, which is the Greek word for eating oneself. But not only do you burn fat, it literally takes food off the table, no pun intended. But also, when you really see the science behind what it does for your skin and your hair and your brain, it is the best. Now, the only.

Kim Gravel:

What's the book we need to get? What's your book?

Heather Dubrow:

It's called the Dubrow Diet. It's called the Dubrow Diet. It was number one on Amazon when it came out, and it was success. The only thing I will tell you is that now that I am in my mid-50s, I have added more protein to my diet, because that is a new, studied thing. So since that book came out, I will tell you, if you're over 40, I would add a bit of protein during the day.

Kim Gravel:

What's your favorite piece of clothing that you own? That black jacket you got on is pretty high.

Heather Dubrow:

This is cute. This is aloe. Oh, that's like Sophie's Choice. Oh, my gosh.

Kim Gravel:

Well, I.

Heather Dubrow:

Okay. I love anything leopard. And I'll just tell you my most recent favorite thing is I've got this. So let me tell you, Leopard is a neutral.

Kim Gravel:

It is.

Heather Dubrow:

It doesn't come in and out. It's a forever. It is a neutral. I have this really cute leopard Celine sweater. That's my favorite thing right now.

Kim Gravel:

I would love to go through your closet, because I've seen it on TikTok and online.

Heather Dubrow:

Come over anytime lit.

Kim Gravel:

Anybody that's got lights in their. Their hanging places. Okay.

Heather Dubrow:

Yeah, it's good.

Kim Gravel:

All right, I'm coming over. Okay, favorite beauty product?

Heather Dubrow:

Well, it's gotta be Consult Beauty. So we have so many products that do all these different things, but if I had to pick, like, one thing, we have this champagne lift line, of course, because I love champagne, but it lifts and tones and tightens. It's got, like, champagne and gold and black truffle and caviar and all these crazy expensive ingredients from the south of France. But it literally lifts and tones and tightens. And we have products for the face but the body, which are amazing, and I use them every day. But the body cream goes from neck to toes because, honey, you know, gravity goes down and the body is like, we Neglect it. And even if you just put on, you know, cream, that's just for moisturizing. But this really.

Heather Dubrow:

I mean, like, my knees are so much better with this cream. I just love it.

Kim Gravel:

What's it called?

Heather Dubrow:

It's called the Console Beauty Champagne Lift Body Cream.

Kim Gravel:

Oh, my gosh. I've got to get.

Heather Dubrow:

I'll send you some.

Kim Gravel:

Girl, you ain't got to send them on. Buy it by the time I get off of this and I want to get it for my friends, for all my friends. Listen, my body line would be sagging but not dragging, I'm telling you. So we need a lift. Okay, here we go. If you had to star in a totally brand new sitcom show, what would your character be?

Heather Dubrow:

That's such a good question. Because, you know, I think I love that multicams have come back and my girlfriend Leanne Morgan has got a great show girl.

Kim Gravel:

1. So she's my friend. So we. Oh, see, we're so. We're like Kevin Bacon of it all. Leanne is fantastic.

Heather Dubrow:

Isn't she the best girl?

Kim Gravel:

Talk about living your best life in your 50s. Let's go.

Heather Dubrow:

She is so inspiring. That is so funny that we both don't. It's funny because we were Instagram friends. Maybe she was on my podcast years ago.

Kim Gravel:

I don't remember. She probably was on my podcast.

Heather Dubrow:

I think she was on my podcast.

Kim Gravel:

Yeah.

Heather Dubrow:

And then we were Instagram friends and then we met and then we became like friends friends. So now we text and I went to her show and whatever. I just love her. She's so inspiring. But it's funny because her show about starting over I think is just so crazy and inspiring. I would love to do a sitcom about. You know, I know there was a show called Modern Family, but about a real modern family and what they look like these days.

Kim Gravel:

I think we need it. We need sitcoms in our life. We need these. You know, they're not only escapes, but they also kind of. They kind of teach us lessons. You know, they kind of just walk through life with us. Okay, so we're manifesting that for you. Are our phones listening to us? Is Big Brother listening? Really?

Heather Dubrow:

Yeah, girl, listen to me. Our phones are listening to us. And if you believe my husband and I don't know if he hit you with this the other night when you saw him.

Kim Gravel:

He didn't, but I'd love to talk to him.

Heather Dubrow:

Okay, so he believes that we're living in a simulation.

Kim Gravel:

I love him.

Heather Dubrow:

And he literally. He literally will talk to the control room, but what's so funny is he's also a narcissist. So I will say to him, I go, oh, my God, you're such a narcissist that you actually think we're all in your simulation. And he's like, I do.

Kim Gravel:

Okay? And y', all, therein lies the good marriage. I'm telling you, I do that. My husband is so cheap. He's so cheap. We're really just really trying to pray about it. Because, I mean, it's. I mean, there is probably Mason jars buried in our backyard full of money. So if we ever pass or sell our house, y', all.

Kim Gravel:

Someone dig it up. Dig it up. But, yeah, I think. Zac, don't take this wrong. I think all men have a tinge of narcissism. So I can relate to that. Okay, here we go.

Zac Miller:

Oh, by the way, we're definitely in the simulation. Just to throw that out there.

Kim Gravel:

Oh, God, I can't. The next time I see Terry, I've got to ask about it.

Heather Dubrow:

I go, if I come home, and then if. Don't get him started on AI. Cause he's like, cuckoo. And then.

Kim Gravel:

That was my next question for you. Oh.

Heather Dubrow:

Because I said if I come home and you're writing in chalk on the wall, I am going to be very, very worried.

Kim Gravel:

A good thing or a bad? What? Oh, go ahead. I'm sorry.

Zac Miller:

I was gonna say my father in law buried, who passed recently, buried like $30,000 in the backyard. And it got all moldy and gross, and he had to send it into the treasury. And he thought he had lost all this money, but they.

Kim Gravel:

It didn't.

Zac Miller:

Like, it worked out.

Kim Gravel:

But it was a check.

Zac Miller:

I don't know if it was. It was a lot of money, though.

Kim Gravel:

That's.

Zac Miller:

That's maybe too much. But it was a lot of money buried in the backyard.

Kim Gravel:

Yeah. They wrote him a check.

Zac Miller:

You can send. If you have, like, messed up money, you can send. Send it back. You can mail it back to the treasury. Yeah.

Heather Dubrow:

Okay.

Kim Gravel:

Sounds cool.

Heather Dubrow:

Good to know.

Zac Miller:

Anyway, so. Yeah, so if Travis does that, Kim, you can tell him.

Kim Gravel:

Well, right now, I wouldn't mail nothing back to the government. All right, here we go. Is AI good or bad for humanity? This is a good question because I'm a little obsessed with AI, Heather.

Heather Dubrow:

I know. I go back and forth.

Kim Gravel:

Okay, good.

Heather Dubrow:

I think that there are aspects of it that are great. Like, let's talk about healthcare. I mean, if AI can read an X ray or a mammogram or something.

Kim Gravel:

Instantly.

Heather Dubrow:

Yeah, instantly. And more Efficiently than a human without human error. That is a positive. If we can do things faster than we do in labs with humans right now, fantastic. And cure diseases and live longer and live better. Fantastic. I think all of that is great. I worry about a couple of things.

Heather Dubrow:

My son, who's 15, he was joking with me because I was using ChatGPT a lot. He goes, mom, you're gonna lose your critical thinking. And then I started to think he was right. So I was like, okay, let me change the way I use my AI, which I have been doing. And now I don't know if it was like in my head or not in my head, but now I feel better about it. But you know, a lot of kids are using AI to just cheat and write papers for them and what's the point? Yeah, they're not learn anything. And then how. So what AI, what jobs are there going to be?

Kim Gravel:

I know, I mean, it's a scary, you know, wild, wild west out there. But I got to say, from a selfish point of view, where has it been all my life? Can you imagine me in college with AI? I would have killed the game. Killed it.

Heather Dubrow:

But would you? Me too. But would you have had the fire?

Kim Gravel:

I don't know. That's a good question.

Heather Dubrow:

Because here's what I think when I remember I told you that there was like eight, nine years where I was like a stay at home mom. I found, you know, you know, this. But being a mom, especially very young kids, can be very isolating and very depressing.

Kim Gravel:

And lonely. Yes, and lonely.

Heather Dubrow:

And this obviously before online communities, which also can be a little lonely too. Cause you feel like you're comparing yourself. But you know, it was kind of lonely and all that. And I remember I would say to Terry, you know, someday I really hope I can get back into the thing. And he would go, if I showed you a crystal ball and I showed you where you were going to be and 10 years, 15 years, 20 years, he goes, you'd relax. And we still talk about that to this day. And I go, but if I wasn't worried about it, would I have had the fire to, to, you know, take classes or to go for that audition or to make those drum calls or try things, would I have had the drive. I don't know what I think with.

Kim Gravel:

When it comes to AI though. I think that we should use it and not let it use us.

Heather Dubrow:

Well, that's the scary part. And how do you set those boundaries?

Kim Gravel:

I don't know, honey.

Heather Dubrow:

Yeah, that. I mean, therein lies the Problem? I don't know, but I really, I will tell you. Like, I hear from my kids that at school they now have things like, you know how, like lab diamonds, now they have a machine. They can tell if it's a lab diamond or whatever. They have ways to.

Kim Gravel:

Oh, they got it. Yeah.

Heather Dubrow:

They do papers and whatnot through the ChatGPT. So if they're cheating, they're gonna find out. I feel like if the kids would use it as a resource. Like, we used to go to the library. We had the Dewey decimals, encyclopedias. Yeah. We went to the card catalog and we got our books.

Kim Gravel:

Oh, my God, the card catalog.

Heather Dubrow:

Heather, remember that?

Kim Gravel:

Come on. I used to love how they smelt. I used to love how you say that.

Heather Dubrow:

The way they smelled. Oh, my God.

Kim Gravel:

These kids today know nothing. They don't experience anything that we.

Heather Dubrow:

Well, I will tell you. My third child goes to Yale and we went for parents weekend and she took us in the library. So beautiful.

Kim Gravel:

I love it.

Heather Dubrow:

And they have card catalogs.

Kim Gravel:

Yay, Yale.

Heather Dubrow:

I know. I was like, that is very cool. Yeah. So I think if they used it as a resource, it's a tool.

Kim Gravel:

Yeah.

Heather Dubrow:

As a tool or as a tutor, then I think that that would be good. But we can't have humans lose critical thinking or we're screwed.

Kim Gravel:

Well, a lot of them already lost it, so that is.

Heather Dubrow:

Yeah, that's what I'm saying.

Kim Gravel:

There's another episode there. Okay, what is your best on set story on the Real Housewives?

Heather Dubrow:

Um, why? There's so many, but, like, just a huge story, I think was my youngest child started walking. All the cameras were there. We were in the playroom and he got up and took his first step on camera. So I didn't think to pick up my phone because there were all the cameras. There was. And they never showed it. And I never got the footage.

Kim Gravel:

Hey, they'll have to go through the archives for that one when he graduates. You got it. When you do, you gotta get that one on the graduation reel, the video.

Heather Dubrow:

But it was so cute. And the kids have said such cute things on camera over the years that we still quote to this day. I mean, I think my son Nikki was like my oldest son. He was like maybe seven. And Terry said to him, like, what do you want to do someday? And he goes, I don't know. I'm just going to go where the wind takes me.

Kim Gravel:

Me too. Me too.

Heather Dubrow:

I'm like, where's the wind?

Kim Gravel:

Take wisdom. What wisdom? All right. What's one piece of wisdom that you would share with your younger self. You know what?

Heather Dubrow:

I think I would just say it's all gonna be okay.

Kim Gravel:

Yeah. Yeah.

Heather Dubrow:

It's all gonna be okay. And trust your instincts.

Kim Gravel:

Mm. Go with your gut. I love that. Yeah. It's so true. Right? Even when you're young, Listen to that build that. I agree with you 1000%.

Heather Dubrow:

Cause I don't think I did sometimes. Yeah.

Kim Gravel:

Oh, I totally. I didn't just do something last year. I wish I would have trusted my gut. Okay, all right, here's an important one. And please, I'm gonna say get real. Get. What's your favorite junk food? Salty and sweet. Don't say kale chips, because you know.

Heather Dubrow:

I don't like kale chips.

Kim Gravel:

Okay, good. Give me. I mean, total flipping junk food.

Heather Dubrow:

I like anything that's gummy. Like, I like Twizzlers, gummy. I like gummies. I love Twizzlers, and I love Oreos. But they have to be like, double stuff, Oreos, double stuff, mega stuff or mega stuff.

Kim Gravel:

Do you undo the two ends and eat the middle? Or how do you. Or just. Cause I like to do that and eat the crunchy part and then have, like, a little less.

Heather Dubrow:

I like to have the cream last.

Kim Gravel:

Okay.

Heather Dubrow:

Terry calls it. He goes, you always saved the filet for last.

Kim Gravel:

Yeah, I get. It is a bit. The double stuff is thick now.

Heather Dubrow:

Well, I get the mega stuff, so it's like, three of them in there.

Kim Gravel:

It's really.

Heather Dubrow:

It's really good.

Kim Gravel:

Okay, what is your next one? What is your salty?

Heather Dubrow:

Okay, and so my salty. Well, I do, like. All right, so down and darn it, girl.

Kim Gravel:

Down and dirty.

Heather Dubrow:

No, no, I'm trying. I wanna just, like, be sure I'm giving you the right thing. Like, I love tortilla chips, but they have to be really salty. Like, have you ever had chica chips?

Kim Gravel:

Yes.

Heather Dubrow:

Like, chica chips are really salty in the best way. Like, I love those. And they taste.

Kim Gravel:

And salsa. You gotta have salsa with it.

Heather Dubrow:

No, I could just eat them. But, yeah, I like pico de gallo salsa.

Kim Gravel:

Okay. So, yeah, I mean, that's. Yeah, I think that's great. All right.

Heather Dubrow:

And I used to love. I used to love popcorn. Like, I still do. Like, I'm obsessed with popcorn, but it gives me a stomachache, so I just. I have to forego.

Kim Gravel:

Girl, I have such gas with that popcorn now. I mean, it bloats me. Like, I'm six months pregnant.

Heather Dubrow:

It's so bad. It's not worth it anymore.

Kim Gravel:

It's not worth it, but it Is yummy. It soaked in butter. Who's your celebrity crush?

Heather Dubrow:

Terry Dubrow.

Kim Gravel:

Well, besides your husband.

Heather Dubrow:

I'm not sure I really have one. I feel like. I think there's a lot of guys. All right, so I think George Clooney is handsome.

Kim Gravel:

Oh, good gosh. Yes, honey, he's.

Heather Dubrow:

Well, I. Well, listen, I know a girl that dated him for a short period of time when we were in our 20s. And she told me some stuff about they did together in private times. And I was like, wow, everyone should date George Clooney for, like, one week. Like, he should just be with every woman just for, like, a week. Okay.

Kim Gravel:

Okay. He's the dating standard.

Heather Dubrow:

Let us experience that. Yeah.

Kim Gravel:

Can I just say something, Heather? I'm exhausted even thinking about that. Is that bad to say? I mean, I'm over 50 and fabulous, but I'm over 50 and fatigued. Honey, I ain't trying to do all that. This is what I say to my husband when he reaches this little big old toe that he probably hasn't clipped onto my calf at night. I love you. Can't stand it. I love you. Don't touch me.

Kim Gravel:

That's our thing. I love you.

Heather Dubrow:

Don't touch me. Yeah, well, I will say that, you know, I think as women, we all go through those phases, especially in our 40s and 50s. But you know what? I'm kind of into, and I'm trying them now, so I don't have an answer for you.

Kim Gravel:

Okay.

Heather Dubrow:

I have tried things over the years, but there's a company I found that has all kinds of, like, elixirs and creams and things. I've tried a few over the years, but, listen, why not? I mean, I love, you know, hormone replacement therapy. I love it all. So I feel like if there's something that could give you a little boost, why not? I have friends that are really into the pellet. Do you know what that is?

Kim Gravel:

I don't, and I'm afraid to ask what that is.

Heather Dubrow:

Okay, so the pellet, like, it's hormones, but they. It's like a little pellet and they sort of inject it into you.

Kim Gravel:

Oh, Lord.

Heather Dubrow:

But I'm allergic to everything. Plastic, latex, like, everything. So I know if they put that in my body, it would just jump out. So I could not do that. But my friends swear by it, and they're like, oh, my God. I feel like a teenager again. All I wanna do is have sex. I'm like, that seems aggressive.

Heather Dubrow:

Too hard. But maybe there's a nieve.

Heather Dubrow:

Yes. So I'm gonna try out these other things just because I thought, you know, look, sometimes I'm in the mood, sometimes I'm not. That's this age. That's okay. But I want. I'm just curious to see if these things actually work. And since I'm Mrs. Guinea Pig, I thought I'd try them out and I'll let you know.

Kim Gravel:

Let me know. Can I just say, your new show is Heather D After Dark.

Heather Dubrow:

That's so funny. Hd Heather After Drawing.

Kim Gravel:

Hd.

Heather Dubrow:

Here we go.

Kim Gravel:

Oh, my God, We've just done it. Victoria, Brandon, let's go.

Heather Dubrow:

There it is.

Kim Gravel:

Follow Heather on Instagram and TikTok @heatherdubrow. Check out her product line. Consult Beauty. Her podcast is called Between Us. Go listen to all. You can. Hear it on all the podcast platforms, y'. All.

Kim Gravel:

You've gotta go check it out. Read her book, the Dubrow Diet. I'm getting it right after we get off this interval eating to lose weight and feel ageless. Heather. Till we meet again, my love. We've got a lot of business to do in 2026.

Heather Dubrow:

A lot of business. Love you, dear.

Kim Gravel:

Love you, Heather. 

Kim Gravel:

Zac Miller is the Executive Producer of the Kim Gravel Show. His production company is Uncommon Audio. Our Producer is Kathleen Grant, the Brunette Exec. Production help from Emily Bredin and Sara Noto. Our cover art is designed by Sanaz Huber at Memarian Creative. Our show is edited by Mike Kligerman. Our guest intros are performed by Roxy Reese. Our guest booking is done by Central Talent Booking. Our ads are furnished by True Native Media. And y'all, I want to give a big huge thank you to the entire team at QVC+ and a special thank you to our audience for making this community so strong. If you are still listening then you must have liked a few episodes along the way. So tell somebody about it. Tell somebody about this show and join our mailing list at kimgravelshow.com. I cannot do this show without you and so I thank you from the bottom of my heart for listening. I hope you gain a little bit of encouragement, light and love love from watching and listening to The Kim Gravel Show. I love you all so much. Till next time. Bye.